Missing actor at 09:19, 16 August 2008

2008-08-16T09:19:17Z

Missing actor: New page: [ഞാ ആഗ് 17 2008] * You have joined channel #bmslug [08:32] * Users on #bmslug: shyam_k prasad @ChanServ ...

2008-08-16T07:50:13Z

New page: <nowiki>[ഞാ ആഗ് 17 2008]</nowiki> <nowiki>*** You have joined channel #bmslug [08:32]</nowiki> <nowiki>*** Users on #bmslug: shyam_k prasad @ChanServ </nowiki> <nowiki>...

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<nowiki>[ഞാ ആഗ് 17 2008]</nowiki>

<nowiki>*** You have joined channel #bmslug [08:32]</nowiki>

<nowiki>*** Users on #bmslug: shyam_k prasad @ChanServ </nowiki>

<nowiki>*** #bmslug modes: +sn</nowiki>

<nowiki>*** #bmslug was created on ഞായര്‍ 2008/08/10 09:32:18 IST</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> hi</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> thanks</nowiki>

<nowiki>*** t3rm1n4l (n=slynux@59.93.12.130) has joined channel #bmslug</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> hi all:)</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> hi all</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> hi prasad :)</nowiki>

<nowiki><t3rm1n4l> hi</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> we are about to start</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> good! [08:33]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> thanks to praveen ji too!</nowiki>

<nowiki>*** prasad (n=prasad@121.245.56.255) has set the topic for #bmslug: "No</nowiki>

<nowiki> Software Patents Bangalore Discussion</nowiki>

<nowiki> http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Say_No_To_Software_Patents"</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> can i say about this in #gnu or #fsf?! or do we expect some experts</nowiki>

<nowiki> to participate? [08:34]</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> shyam_k, ok</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> shyam_k, nagarjuna sir is suppose to join here now [08:37]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> great!</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> in the irc? or physically?!</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> ;-)</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> irc [08:38]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> great! wonderful! [08:39]</nowiki>

<nowiki>*** gn (n=nagarjun@sentry.hbcse.tifr.res.in) has joined channel #bmslug</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> wow! hi gn :)</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> hi</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> gn, hi we started [08:40]</nowiki>

<nowiki>ERC> /query prasad [08:41]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> is the 27th meeting confirmed</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> gn, venky is telling it is confirmed</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> now and then send me a summary of what you people are talking. I will</nowiki>

<nowiki> keep this session on [08:42]</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> gn, can you just brief us about the current situation?</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> to help people who file patent applications, indian patent office is</nowiki>

<nowiki> writing a manual [08:44]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> its draft is what is being discussed</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> this draft is not only about software, but about how to file patents in</nowiki>

<nowiki> general</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> the draft does say clearly that 'software per se is not patentable' as</nowiki>

<nowiki> per the law. [08:45]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> however, the instructions given in the manual clearly tell people that</nowiki>

<nowiki> you can file software patents in combination with hardware</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> what we have to do is to not let that interpretation go under 3(k).</nowiki>

<nowiki> [08:46]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> please see sectiion 4 for non-patentable items. and read the relevant</nowiki>

<nowiki> sections.</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> previously the industry tried to change the law by a presidential</nowiki>

<nowiki> ordinance but parliament rejected it. [08:47]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> that should be our argument. how can the manual try to enable a</nowiki>

<nowiki> possibility that law forbids. [08:48]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> and most important:</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> software does not work unless in combination with hardware.</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> therefore, if software in combination with hardware is patentable, then</nowiki>

<nowiki> all software is patentable</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> that is obsurd.</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> this is the strongest argument to not make such statements in the manual</nowiki>

<nowiki> [08:49]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> and we should interpret such attempts as equivalent to backdoor entries</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> to abuse the law</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> does it make sense, or you want any elaboration</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> gn, it is good [08:52]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> and it seems some patents have already filed stating the software</nowiki>

<nowiki> works differently with different size of ram etc.. and i read in</nowiki>

<nowiki> businessline in a news about providing free internet through</nowiki>

<nowiki> kiosk,that the system including the software are patented.. it seems</nowiki>

<nowiki> the news is this</nowiki>

<nowiki> http://www.thehindubusinessline.com/2008/05/07/stories/2008050751862300.htm</nowiki>

<nowiki> but i am not sure.. [08:53]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> patents are filed, and I do not think they are granted. [08:54]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> ah yes..</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> we need to be vigilant and object</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> however, currently our focus should not be diffused</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> concentrate on the elaborations and help statements written under 3(k),</nowiki>

<nowiki> and ensure that they say clearly that software in combination with</nowiki>

<nowiki> hardware is not patentable [08:55]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> those industries who are pushing this through backdoor must be informed</nowiki>

<nowiki> that:</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> is that draft available online?</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> 1. software is already protected under IPR under copyright, and no</nowiki>

<nowiki> additional protection either to individuals or industries is required</nowiki>

<nowiki> [08:56]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> 2. hardware innovations are already patentable under the regular</nowiki>

<nowiki> innovations</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> therefore all innovators are already covered</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> 3. the current ICt revolutioin happened is a fact on the face that we do</nowiki>

<nowiki> not need any more encouragement to the innovators [08:57]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> and keep science and technology under public domain.</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> yes the draft is available on the patent office site [08:58]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> If you cannot find it, I can mail it to you</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> shyam_k, it is listed in FCI page</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> oh ok.. [08:59]</nowiki>

<nowiki><gn> read james message now, and one of you head to doordarshan's office today</nowiki>

<nowiki> if possible</nowiki>

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<nowiki> [09:00]</nowiki>

<nowiki>ERC> /query [09:01]</nowiki>

<nowiki>Incorrect arguments. Usage:</nowiki>

<nowiki>/QUERY &optional user</nowiki>

<nowiki>Open a query with USER.</nowiki>

<nowiki>The type of query window/frame/etc will depend on the value of</nowiki>

<nowiki>`erc-query-display'.</nowiki>

<nowiki></nowiki>

<nowiki>If USER is omitted, close the current query buffer if one exists</nowiki>

<nowiki>- except this is broken now ;-)</nowiki>

<nowiki>ERC> /query jinsbond007 </nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> gn, What is it about? [09:06]</nowiki>

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<nowiki><no_mind> hello [09:12]</nowiki>

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<nowiki><no_mind> ok discuss patents [09:19]</nowiki>

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<nowiki> [09:20]</nowiki>

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<nowiki> (Connection timed out) [09:21]</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> g1, software is not worn out [09:23]</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> g1, how is it an argument against software patents?</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> g1, it was in Lawrence's document [09:24]</nowiki>

<nowiki>*** coolbhavi (n=bhavi@59.92.135.133) has joined channel #bmslug [09:35]</nowiki>

<nowiki><coolbhavi> when does meet start?</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> coolbhavi: it has started.. with nagarjuna sir briefing the</nowiki>

<nowiki> situation.. i can pm the logs if you want.. [09:36]</nowiki>

<nowiki><coolbhavi> shyam_k, isnt it over irc? [09:37]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> its primarily offline at bms college..</nowiki>

<nowiki><coolbhavi> shyam_k, Ok! i just returned home from college.. I dint have a</nowiki>

<nowiki> look at the auditorium ...:) [09:38]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> !:)</nowiki>

<nowiki><coolbhavi> shyam_k, are you from BMS? [09:40]</nowiki>

<nowiki><no_mind> now where is bms college ?</nowiki>

<nowiki><coolbhavi> Bangalore [09:41]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> coolbhavi: no</nowiki>

<nowiki><coolbhavi> I am a student of that college no_mind [09:42]</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> coolbhavi, PG block</nowiki>

<nowiki><coolbhavi> prasad, PG block which floor [09:43]</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> first floor vishweshwarayya hall [09:44]</nowiki>

<nowiki><coolbhavi> ok! dept of environmental engineering got it! [09:45]</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> we will summarise it and update on the wiki [09:48]</nowiki>

<nowiki><prasad> http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Say_No_To_Software_Patents</nowiki>

<nowiki>*** prasad (n=prasad@121.245.56.255) has quit: "Leaving"</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> ah now anyone here from bms? i have the answer for prasad.. [09:55]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> Software doesn't wear out: In other industries, research continues</nowiki>

<nowiki> up to a point where</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> further research costs too much to be feasible. At this stage, the</nowiki>

<nowiki> industry's output merely</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> consists of replacing parts that have worn out.</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> However, in the software sector, a computer program that is</nowiki>

<nowiki> fully debugged will</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> perform its function forever without requiring maintenance or</nowiki>

<nowiki> modification. “What this</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> means is that unlike socks that wear out, and breakfast cereal that</nowiki>

<nowiki> is eaten, a particular</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> software product can be sold to a particular customer at most</nowiki>

<nowiki> once. If it is to be sold to</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> that customer again, it must be enhanced with new features and</nowiki>

<nowiki> functionality.” This</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> inevitably means that even if the industry were to approach</nowiki>

<nowiki> maturity, any software</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> company that does not produce new and innovative products will</nowiki>

<nowiki> simply run out of</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> customers! Thus, the industry will remain innovative whether or not</nowiki>

<nowiki> software patents</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> exist.</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> </nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> ops sorry for flooding..!:( [09:56]</nowiki>

<nowiki><karunakar> patent in this case would imply - let me patent it so that no one</nowiki>

<nowiki> else can do similar enhancement, to sell more! [09:58]</nowiki>

<nowiki><coolbhavi> shyam_k, no problems its a small channel</nowiki>

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<nowiki> [09:59]</nowiki>

<nowiki><shyam_k> anivar ji just called me.. and he said that the meeting is over</nowiki>

<nowiki> there.. and they are planning public protest and all by 22 or 23 or</nowiki>

<nowiki> so.. first hand information will be there in wiki soon.. and i am</nowiki>

<nowiki> adding the irc log too.. [10:00]</nowiki>

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<nowiki> [10:11]</nowiki>

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Say No To Software Patents/Chatlog - Revision history

Missing actor at 09:19, 16 August 2008

Missing actor: New page: [ഞാ ആഗ് 17 2008] *** You have joined channel #bmslug [08:32] *** Users on #bmslug: shyam_k prasad @ChanServ ...

Missing actor: New page: [ഞാ ആഗ് 17 2008] * You have joined channel #bmslug [08:32] * Users on #bmslug: shyam_k prasad @ChanServ ...